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ammek
To those notorious constants of life — death and taxes — perhaps we should now add pathetic Packer special teams. After ranking in the top half of the league every year but one (2002) in the first half of the decade, according to DVOA, the Packers have performed dismally on special teams since Ted Thompson took over. Mike Stock was canned for last year's fiasco, but ironically the standard has gotten worse thus far in 2009:

Packer special teams ranking by year:
2005: 30th
2006: 29th
2007: 8th
2008: 20th
2009: 25th.

It's not just the overall ranking. The 2009 Packers are below average at every aspect of special teams measured by DVOA: field goals/extra points, kickoffs, kickoff returns, punts, and punt returns.

The kickers are least to blame. Mason Crosby's field goals are a fraction below average when adjusted for distance and weather, and his kickoffs have been fine. Jeremy Kapinos is below average, though not to a Derrick Frost degree. But coverage on kicks and punts remains horrendous, with long gains conceded to opponents great (Cribbs, Harvin) and small (Quan Crosby). As a result, opponents are beginning their average drive halfway between their own 32 and 33 yard line, fully six yards ahead of opponents of the (7th-ranked) Vikings — in spite of the fact that the Packers lead the league with fewest giveaways.

Injuries to Will Blackmon, Jordy Nelson and Brandon Jackson account for some of the problems with the Packers' own return teams. But it would be hard to feel confident about the unit even if they were fit. Despite the team's league-leading turnover ratio, the Packers are losing the battle of field position by nearly 2 yards on each drive. Over a whole season, that works out to a net loss of about 700 yards — or 40 points.

This underperformance is particularly galling in the light of certain personnel moves which were carried out on the basis of special teams play. And lest we forget, one of the justifications for the move to the 3-4 defense was having more linebackers available for kick coverage.

Maybe it will get better. (Do you find yourself saying that a lot, as a Packer fan, these days?) So far, it has not.
JASIII
QUOTE (ammek @ Nov 4 2009, 09:09 AM) *
To those notorious constants of life — death and taxes — perhaps we should now add pathetic Packer special teams. After ranking in the top half of the league every year but one (2002) in the first half of the decade, according to DVOA, the Packers have performed dismally on special teams since Ted Thompson took over. Mike Stock was canned for last year's fiasco, but ironically the standard has gotten worse thus far in 2009:

Packer special teams ranking by year:
2005: 30th
2006: 29th
2007: 8th
2008: 20th
2009: 25th.

It's not just the overall ranking. The 2009 Packers are below average at every aspect of special teams measured by DVOA: field goals/extra points, kickoffs, kickoff returns, punts, and punt returns.

The kickers are least to blame. Mason Crosby's field goals are a fraction below average when adjusted for distance and weather, and his kickoffs have been fine. Jeremy Kapinos is below average, though not to a Derrick Frost degree. But coverage on kicks and punts remains horrendous, with long gains conceded to opponents great (Cribbs, Harvin) and small (Quan Crosby). As a result, opponents are beginning their average drive halfway between their own 32 and 33 yard line, fully six yards ahead of opponents of the (7th-ranked) Vikings — in spite of the fact that the Packers lead the league with fewest giveaways.

Injuries to Will Blackmon, Jordy Nelson and Brandon Jackson account for some of the problems with the Packers' own return teams. But it would be hard to feel confident about the unit even if they were fit. Despite the team's league-leading turnover ratio, the Packers are losing the battle of field position by nearly 2 yards on each drive. Over a whole season, that works out to a net loss of about 700 yards — or 40 points.

This underperformance is particularly galling in the light of certain personnel moves which were carried out on the basis of special teams play. And lest we forget, one of the justifications for the move to the 3-4 defense was having more linebackers available for kick coverage.

Maybe it will get better. (Do you find yourself saying that a lot, as a Packer fan, these days?) So far, it has not.

Sad but true. Losing the field position battle is what really bothers me.
rpiotr01
Good article.

The special teams problems are mostly problems of coverage - not covering our own guys well enough, and horrible coverage on opposing kick-offs and punts. My guess is that this is tied directly to the youth of the back-ups on our team over this period. When a significant proportion of your back-ups are "fresh out of the box" new, and back-ups play a major ST roll, well, you're going to get results like this.

Youth on ST rears its head especially in big moments: recall Jarrett Bush trying to pick up that fumble in the NFCC rather than fall on it; the huge return allowed by the kick-off coverage last year against Carolina after we had just kicked a FG to go up late in the game; the huge returns allowed against Cincinnati this year; and, of course, the monster performance by Harvin this past week, especially after we cut the lead to 4 points and had all the momentum in the world. It's a loss of focus, and a change in intensity or discipline when the pressure is raised. And that's not even to mention the penalties.

It's all directly tied to youth, and indirectly tied to poor coaching that isn't doing a good job of settling these guys down and holding them accountable.
VoiceofReason
I don't think it has anything to do with youth. Every team has mostly young players on ST, always been that way. And many of the guys who play ST for the Apckers have been around for 3 or 4 years. It's not like it's all rookies out there.

What's most dissapointing is that TT/MM made roster decisions to keep guys primarliy for ST and it still hasn't worked.
ammek
QUOTE (VoiceofReason @ Nov 4 2009, 05:38 PM) *
I don't think it has anything to do with youth. Every team has mostly young players on ST, always been that way. And many of the guys who play ST for the Apckers have been around for 3 or 4 years. It's not like it's all rookies out there.


Agreed.
I think it shows that a lot of the Packers' problems come down to execution — in other words, players not doing what they've been coached to do. Whether they are freelancing or trying to do too much or simply outmanned, I don't know.
In any case, the accountability question raises its head.
stuffin
Damn you, I was avoiding this depressing part of the team. Now I've got to get an appointment with my Therapist.
rolleyes.gif

Seriously though, we were expecting mega improvements on Special Teams and that just has not happened. Blame youth, coaching, poor play or whatever, but Special teams is an important part of the puzzle and we seem to be missing a few pieces.
sinatra
Coaching.
ammek
QUOTE (stuffin @ Nov 4 2009, 06:20 PM) *
Damn you, I was avoiding this depressing part of the team. Now I've got to get an appointment with my Therapist.
rolleyes.gif


OK, next time I'll post about something more cheerful. Penalties?
craig
I also agree that youth isn't the reason. All teams populate their special teams with mostly athletic backups, and most athletic backups are young. There just aren't that many backups that are older and athletic.

I don't know why we are so consistently poor. We know the Packers are consistently undisciplined, (see penalties), and that certainly seems to carry over to ST. Beyond that, are they outmanned physically, or too dumb, or both?

It has seemed fairly evident that we just don't have speed or quickness on the team. Watching return guys for other teams, they all seem to have some burst, either some breakaway speed or some elusiveness, some jukes and fakes and that sort of thing, or both. The Packer return guys seem much less dangerous. Jordy runs fine but he's a straight-line guy, no fakes or burst, and his speed isn't exceptional. Green, Jackson, these guys aren't burners or shake-and-bake quick explosion guys either. Blackmon is the one guy who at times has some moves. But most of our candidates seem to be conservative guys: hope you don't fumble, then run straight up the middle as fast as you can. They don't really create openings for themselves.
Terranimal
QUOTE (stuffin @ Nov 4 2009, 11:20 AM) *
Damn you, I was avoiding this depressing part of the team. Now I've got to get an appointment with my Therapist.
rolleyes.gif

Seriously though, we were expecting mega improvements on Special Teams and that just has not happened. Blame youth, coaching, poor play or whatever, but Special teams is an important part of the puzzle and we seem to be missing a few pieces.


Hey your Therapist must be making a mint with all the blunders this team is making huh? j/k

I bet you must be bumping into A-Rod too ? As he must have nightmares of getting sacked as these inept OL let the blitzers through? mad.gif

It does seem like the quest that never gets resolved don't it? What is even more disappointing is all the so-called extra time they supposedly put into ST's in camp and so on. No answers and none in sight...ugghhh.

This is like a ship taking on water with multiple holes to repair as it's sinking..........OL, running game, lack of sacks and pressure; ST's and penalities.....Dang, hey is the name of your Therapist? Think I might need help too. Oh, that's right I have one...named Jack D. smile.gif

New Defense Slogan : [color="#FF0000"][/color]"LET THE DOGS LOOSE!!!!"
Rob
Anyone know if Tracy White is available?
DaveKenya
I blame everything on Jarrett Bush. sleep.gif
ammek
Well, that might be the worst game the coverage units have played yet. Give up a blocked punt, an 80-something yard kickoff return, a handful of medium-sized punt returns on pooch kicks … and commit penalties to boot. That's unacceptable. Mike Stock, a 20-year NFL veteran, was canned for a lot less.

Also, Tramon Williams bobbled a kick and continued dancing around his own goalline on others. Injuries are a factor here, but surely someone on the roster — Brandon Jackson? — can do better.

However, I don't blame the punter for a couple of weak kicks: it was windy out there, and he looked hurried following the block.
R man
QUOTE (ammek @ Nov 8 2009, 04:45 PM) *
Well, that might be the worst game the coverage units have played yet. Give up a blocked punt, an 80-something yard kickoff return, a handful of medium-sized punt returns on pooch kicks … and commit penalties to boot. That's unacceptable. Mike Stock, a 20-year NFL veteran, was canned for a lot less.

Also, Tramon Williams bobbled a kick and continued dancing around his own goalline on others. Injuries are a factor here, but surely someone on the roster — Brandon Jackson? — can do better.

However, I don't blame the punter for a couple of weak kicks: it was windy out there, and he looked hurried following the block.


Last week was embarrassing.. This week, not much better.
DaveKenya
In the last few games, I've noticed poor containment of lanes when we are covering punts and kickoffs. It seems the opponent's returner - esp on kickoffs - gains considerable yardage when reversing field. Our outside gunner(s) on the opposite side of the play seem to stray way too far to the center of the field rather than maintain lanes and containment. Why does this continue to happen? I'd think some stern conversations and re-education would do the trick, but it keeps recurring.

Rant: I'm really sick of seeing Jordy Nelson immediately nailed after fielding a punt while our opponent punt returners seem to have 5+ yards of returning before a Packer is there to attempt a tackle. What gives? Why do our outside gunners suck so badly getting down to make tackles and also fail miserably in containing opponents' gunners that make these quick tackles on our punt returners?

The culprits seem to be Collins, Bigby, Bush...

What gives?
mazrimiv
QUOTE (DaveKenya @ Nov 28 2009, 03:17 AM) *
Rant: I'm really sick of seeing Jordy Nelson immediately nailed after fielding a punt while our opponent punt returners seem to have 5+ yards of returning before a Packer is there to attempt a tackle. What gives? Why do our outside gunners suck so badly getting down to make tackles and also fail miserably in containing opponents' gunners that make these quick tackles on our punt returners?

It's not just the gunners, it also involves the opposing punter having a better hangtime/distance ratio than Kapinos. Makes a huge difference when covering punts.
Big Dave
I think when MM was cleaning house last year, his one big mistake was promoting Shaun Slocum isntead of looking outside for a proven commodity. If I remember correctly, there would a couple of proven guys out there who could have made a difference.

The penalties are beyond embarrassing on special teams this season. How many times is going to take for someone to learn you can't block in the back. I mean, seriously.
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