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Skyshadow
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...6.DTL&tsp=1
QUOTE
Cleveland Browns wide receiver Donte' Stallworth is going to serve 30 days in jail after pleading guilty in Florida to a DUI manslaughter charge.

The plea deal announced Tuesday calls for the 28-year-old Stallworth to also serve 10 years' probation and do 1,000 community service hours for killing a pedestrian he hit with his car. Stallworth had faced up to 15 years in prison.

Police say Stallworth was drinking at a hotel bar before the March 14 crash that killed 59-year-old construction worker Mario Reyes. Tests showed Stallworth's blood-alcohol content was .126.

Stallworth also reached a confidential financial settlement with the Reyes' family.

Are you freaking kidding me? 30 days for getting drunk and killing a man with your car?

I need to become a celebrity -- I'll save a fortune in cab fares.
PackerJB
Quite ridiculous. I love how people's lives pretty much have a price tag on them. It's great and all that he and the Reyes family reached a settlement, but 30 frickin days? You said it Skyshadow, we need to become celebrities!
IceBowlWitnessBoy
QUOTE (Skyshadow @ Jun 16 2009, 11:52 AM) *
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...6.DTL&tsp=1

Are you freaking kidding me? 30 days for getting drunk and killing a man with your car?

I need to become a celebrity -- I'll save a fortune in cab fares.

Another example of the fact that in this country, you can buy your way out of anything.

Greed rears it's ugly head again.

The Reyes family was bought off. I wonder why the amount is undisclosed, don't we have a right to know?

Gotta love lawyers, greed and spoiled, above the law professional athletes.

What a culture we live in, where killing dogs is treated much more harshly than killing a human. blink.gif
Packergeist
QUOTE (Skyshadow @ Jun 16 2009, 11:52 AM) *
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...6.DTL&tsp=1

Are you freaking kidding me? 30 days for getting drunk and killing a man with your car?

I need to become a celebrity -- I'll save a fortune in cab fares.

Not sure why you felt compelled to draw the Vick/Dog comparison. Since you mentioned fairness, you must
realize that had Stallworth killed a dog with his car instead of a man, his punishment if any would be far
less severe. If Vick had done to a man what he did to dogs, he likely would never leave prison.

Having said that, I agree the punishment is a slap on the wrist. Celebrity does have it's advantages. Now if you
got drunk and killed Vick or Stallworth or both with your car, I think it's safe to say you would gain instant celebrity. Has a certain circle of life ring to it. But you would easily use up all of your cab fare savings with lawyer fees. Plus then you'd be hounded by the whole "People for the ethical treatment of worthless pieces of crap" crowd. So, probably not worth it.
Packergeist
QUOTE (IceBowlWitnessBoy @ Jun 16 2009, 12:39 PM) *
Another example of the fact that in this country, you can buy your way out of anything.

Greed rears it's ugly head again.

The Reyes family was bought off. I wonder why the amount is undisclosed, don't we have a right to know?

Gotta love lawyers, greed and spoiled, above the law professional athletes.

What a culture we live in, where killing dogs is treated much more harshly than killing a human. blink.gif

The problem is not how harshly we treat those that kill dogs. The problem is how lenient we are with those that kill humans.
ricky
QUOTE (Packergeist @ Jun 17 2009, 12:45 AM) *
The problem is not how harshly we treat those that kill dogs. The problem is how lenient we are with those that kill humans.


Thank you sir. I was ready to go on a rant. Instead, you encapsulated my thoughts.

When will it occur to anyone that we need to take care of each other? And that abusing a helpless animal is an abomination?

Sorry, I need to work off some anger- I think I'll take our pups for a long walk while I calm down.
LuvdaPack36
Read the ESPN article and it says how Stallworth is taking "full repsonsibility" for what he did.

What a joke.
Ellis269
Just to play the devil's advocate. . .

Mr. Reyes also contributed to this accident by illegally crossing an extremely busy road. If he chose to fight this battle in court, Donte Stallworth very likely could have been acquitted on the DUI manslaughter charge. He could have chosen to drag out any type of settlement with the family and make them drag it out of him in civil court. Instead, he accepted a full plea bargain which includes the felony charge of DUI Manslaughter (no pleading to a lesser charge BS), he paid an agreeable amount of restitution to the family, he will serve some time in jail (despite it only being a first offense), two years of house arrest and six of probation and he agreed to never again drive a vehicle. In my opinion, Donte Stallworth did everything that was asked of him by the authorities, court system and the family of the victim. What more should he have done? Putting him in jail longer would not make the situation any better for the victims of his crime, nor would it prevent him from further acts of dangerous behavior or crime against those around him. Donte Stallworth has never claimed that it was the victim's fault. He admitted to his behavior and took action to accept criminal and civil responsibility for his actions. He didn't hide behind his lawyers. He didn't drag anything out. He worked out an acceptable multi-level punishment for a stupid decision that resulted in the death of another man.

Before you accuse me of being a celebrity apologist, let me say that I personally think that what he did was horrible. Drunk driving is often downplayed in our society, but it is a very serious problem. I lost my sister in a drunk driving accident two years ago, and only a month ago a drunk driver crossed into my lane and hit my car head on. Me and my children were severely injured and hospitalized. I've got a long road back to my physical recovery. The woman who hit us was not severely injured and likely won't be seriously punished. I'd recommend her taking a slap on the wrist if it meant that she were to (a.) admit responsibility, (b.) pay me and my family adequate restitution for the financial difficulties we face because of her actions, (c.) go to jail (even for a short while. . . which she won't), (d.) be placed on house arrest, (e.) face a long probation and (f.) surrender her drivers license for even a little while. I won't get any one of those things. . . much less all of them. I don't think that the Reyes family "sold out" at all. I'm living a relatively similar situation right now and I can attest that being hit by someone who is not famous and has no money does not mean that they will get a more severe penalty.
KC Pack Fan
Well written post Ellis. Although I believe there should be stiffer penalties across the board for something like this. What price can you put on a human life?


I hope you and your children have a speedy recovery.
IceBowlWitnessBoy
QUOTE (Packergeist @ Jun 16 2009, 12:45 PM) *
The problem is not how harshly we treat those that kill dogs. The problem is how lenient we are with those that kill humans.

And yes, I agree, as stated above.

We're on the same page on this one.
Ellis269
And to be fair, I might feel a little more hard-assed about it if my son had died. Thankfully we all survived. I think that being convicted driving drunk and causing an accident should require jail time and suspension of a driver's license. I feel sorry for the Reyes family. It's a tragedy that he was hit and killed in that accident. Since it occurred though, Donte Stallworth has in fact taken responsibility for his actions, cooperated with authorities and done everything that he could do to make amends for his involvement in this unfortunate incident. He made a horrible mistake and it cost a man his life. So far, he's taken more responsibility for his actions than ANY other person I've ever heard of who has caused an accident because of drunk driving. IMO he could have easily pushed the issue until the prosecutor offered him a deal that was less than the felony DUI Manslaughter charge that he accepted. DUI is a misdemeanor. The fact that he accepted a deal that included the felony manslaughter charge tell me that he is truly trying to take responsibility for his actions. While I don't condone his behavior and I think that the result is reprehensible, I hope that the aftermath of this event is more awareness and education about the damage that drunk driving can cause. Since he can't change the past and erase what happened it sure seems to me that he's doing the best that he can to make amends and do some good. I hope that it does some good.
Skyshadow
Just to provide perspective, Stallworth got 30 days for being guilty of a crime whose minimum sentence is 4 years.

Crossing a busy highway on foot is a stupid idea, but it doesn't change the fact that Stallworth was drunk and behind the wheel.
IceBowlWitnessBoy
QUOTE (Skyshadow @ Jun 17 2009, 04:24 PM) *
Just to provide perspective, Stallworth got 30 days for being guilty of a crime whose minimum sentence is 4 years.

Crossing a busy highway on foot is a stupid idea, but it doesn't change the fact that Stallworth was drunk and behind the wheel.

Thanks for pointing out the bottom line Sky..... smile.gif
zmanishere11
Nice post Ellis, and I agree with you.

There are only two things that are truly obvious in this case: Stallworth had been drinking, and Mr. Reyes contributed significantly to his own death.

For ANYONE to get the full sentence, you'd have to argue that the sole reason Mr. Reyes was killed was by Stallworth's decision to drink excessively and get behind the wheel of a car while imparied, and you just can't argue that in this case. The guy didn't use a cross walk, and tried to cross a busy highway early in the morning, it's not unreasonable to think a car could smoke you.

Now for your situation Ellis, that's clear as she crossed the line while drunk, it's pretty clear it was her fault and only her fault.

I'm very much ok with Stallworth's sentence. The guy can't drive anymore, gets some jailtime, 2 years house arrest, and if he screws up again WILL go to jail for a long time. Plus Mr. Reye's daughter and family is set for their future.


Now if you want to whine and moan about how unfair his sentence is, leave Vick out of it. Vick is not doing time for killing dogs, he's doing it for running an illegal gambling operation. But you could compare it to Burress, who's going to get a few years for accidentally shooting himself. That's a damn shame.
zmanishere11
QUOTE (IceBowlWitnessBoy @ Jun 17 2009, 05:40 PM) *
Thanks for pointing out the bottom line Sky..... smile.gif


Yes, the bottom line is Stallworth is guilty of driving drunk. That is very clear.

You cannot tell me that that was the sole, or even the main reason for this ACCIDENT.
GBP4EVER
Stallworth=Lenoard Little. Both trash that got away with DUI murder. I hope the hammer keeps him out for the whole year.
Jeremy
It sounds like the commish is bringing down the hammer on this one. Might miss up to a year or more. Which could effectively end his career as he was an average player to begin with. There are teams who care nothing about character and would hire the devil himself if they thought he could help them win (*coughcowboyscough). But everyone gets pretty righteous when the player in question isn't all that good.

It's interesting that Stallworth's accepting responsibility for his mistake doesn't appear to have moved Roger Goodell one iota. A lot has been said about Vick making it worse on himself by lying to his face at the draft. They always say the cover up is worse than the crime, and usually that's true. Here it appears Stallworth might have been better off trying to fight it, at least in terms of how it might affect his playing career. Had he gone to trial and been acquitted, he'd probably still be allowed to play.

So the Commish is setting a couple precidents here. One, DUI will not be tolerated (especially if you kill somebody!), and two, don't expect the Commish to take remorse or accepting responsibility into account. And maybe he is taking it into account. I guess we'll see.



adrenaline
I could have sworn that the guy who got hit and killed was on the sidewalk. I had thought that Donte said he swerved to avoid a stopped car and ran the guy over instead. I could be wrong.. but without doing research thats what I recall.
GBP4EVER
QUOTE (adrenaline @ Jun 19 2009, 06:54 PM) *
I could have sworn that the guy who got hit and killed was on the sidewalk. I had thought that Donte said he swerved to avoid a stopped car and ran the guy over instead. I could be wrong.. but without doing research thats what I recall.


From what I heard he was crossing the street but not in a crosswalk. To me he just paid the family enough money that they agreed to ask the judge for no trial. I hope he had to give up pretty much all his money to the family and then the Browns cut him and no team signs him and he ends up spending the rest of his life working some job that pays him 10 bucks a hour.
LuvdaPack36
We just had a case around here where the family is livid over the sentence. Guy was from a pretty ritzy part of town called Mission Hills. Family had quite a bit of money. Apparently he was out drinking one night, hit and killed a guy on a bike, left the scene but turned himself in a few days later.

He got a 5 year sentence but was released after only 120 days.


http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-hit-run-probati...,0,556299.story


GBP4EVER
QUOTE (LuvdaPack36 @ Jun 19 2009, 10:13 PM) *
We just had a case around here where the family is livid over the sentence. Guy was from a pretty ritzy part of town called Mission Hills. Family had quite a bit of money. Apparently he was out drinking one night, hit and killed a guy on a bike, left the scene but turned himself in a few days later.

He got a 5 year sentence but was released after only 120 days.


http://www.fox4kc.com/wdaf-hit-run-probati...,0,556299.story


yes your honor mommy made me drink and force me to drive and hit and kill that man then drive away. Oh by the way did you get our check for you re-election campagin?

Judge is crooked I bet.
LuvdaPack36
QUOTE (GBP4EVER @ Jun 19 2009, 11:10 PM) *
yes your honor mommy made me drink and force me to drive and hit and kill that man then drive away. Oh by the way did you get our check for you re-election campagin?

Judge is crooked I bet.




Its all "old money" down there. Most of the families are the ones that built Kansas City. Everyone is each others back pockets.
GBP4EVER
what a piece of trash this guy is. Did not even have to serve the full 30 days. Got out after 24 days. Said to see that being rich can literally allow you to get away with murder.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4318550
lambeauleaper
Everyone is piling on about how Stallworth got off because he's rich, famous, whatever. The fact of the matter is, this (as horrible as it may sound) isn't that unusual. My wife is a probation officer here in Phoenix and has a guy on her caseload that killed an elderly woman crossing the street while he was intoxicated. He served NO PRISON time for this crime. He was bonded out and put on probation. This was just a regular guy, not rich, nothing. All it really takes is a decent attorney that can get a good plea agreement and a judge that has never had a family member get killed by a drunk driver.

edit: and as I was verifying the facts on this with my wife, she kind of sighed and said "this happens all the time, it's not abnormal by any stretch".
pkrjones
... and the NFL has suspended him for the '09 season without pay.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4396130
gametimetwo
Lady Justice is blind and she will stay blind for the right price.
Terry
Some of you keep talking trash in this thread (about money buying off justice, about the sort of character the guy has, etc) in spite of the evidence that some posters have written that suggests otherwise. I wonder if some people even read what others have to say in these threads or just spout off thoughtlessly without paying attention. Meanwhile, I seriously wonder how many people in these threads who are over forty have never driven drunk. Hell, even those who are younger.

As has been already argued by several posters, it's unlikely that celebrity and wealth had anything to do with the outcome of this case. In cases like this, which involve isolated low level celebrities, the state often likes to throw the book at individuals because there are no knock-on effects which reach deeper into elite circles. This has the effect of 'proving' to the plebs (that's us) that justice really is blind, that it's equal for all, that American democracy is based on the rule of law, and all such good things - which of course is not the case, has never been the case, and in fact is becoming less and less the case almost daily as we collectively move even more toward a reverence of royalty. (Little strikes me funnier or more Kafkaesque than seeing the sons and daughters of royalty in privileged positions in the media sitting around together in very Serious discussions about how affirmative action goes against everything American.)

Throwing a second class member of the elite overboard to keep the crew happy and the ship afloat would mean nothing to the state. Quite the contrary, it would be an ideal situation for many prosecutors. So personally I have no difficulty accepting the viewpoints of some posters who seem to have more familiarity with this sort of thing that celebrity didn't enter into it.

Meanwhile, those who indulge in a knee-jerk reaction that less leniency is needed in society, they're living in a fool's paradise. For one thing, you already live in the most draconian society on earth regarding the administration of justice. America has a population that is roughly around 5% of the world's population, yet holds in her prisons 25% of the entire world's prison population. Study after study after study have shown that less leniency and more severe jail terms has no effect on reducing criminal activity. Some of you need to read more and think more creatively.

In a crime of this nature especially, there is nothing to be served by more extreme punishment. Most people in Stallworth's shoes find it very difficult to live with themselves after such an incident anyway. No imposed punishment can damage them as much as they often will damage themselves. I've known of people who had accidents while stone cold sober and the result for them was total devastation and the ruination of their own lives. Christ, how much blood do some of you want to extract from some people?

For the family of the victim to accept money for their loss seems to me to be emminently sensible. No matter how harsh things are made for the culprit, none of it will help the family in the least and it certainly won't bring back their loved one. At least money can have a direct impact upon the physical welfare of the family, even if emotionally it does nothing - emotionally speaking, there is nothing that can do anything to help them.

But none of that would affect the prosecutor or the judge. So it would be reasonable to wonder why they behaved in such a fashion - but I think that's already been answered in these pages.

Furthermore, states are running low on money. Many states are finding it very difficult to maintain their current prison populations. Suddenly, for all that those decades of campaigning for more stringent justice did, states are paroling prisoners left right and center right now, and even just releasing people. I'll refer to this LA Times story as just one source for this. I suspect that in the near future, you'll be seeing more and more people serving a lot less time, particularly for malfeasance arising from foolishness rather than malevolence.

As for the NFL's punishment, I think it's pathetic and pointlessly cruel. What good does it do to deprive a person of their livelihood? If Goodall (or whatever the spelling is) wants to do something useful, it would be better to offer the player reinstatement on the condition that half his salary go toward some public interest, like better education on drinking and driving. That would be a more logical punishment - the player's life and livelihood is not destroyed and yet something very positive comes out of it that might even be beneficial.

Edit PS. As has also been quite effectively pointed out here, there is no comparison to be made between Stallworth and Vick, nor is there some moral lesson, nor is this about dogs and humans. (Personally, I hate those discussions anyway, as if a human life or any life can be quantified and measured in terms of value. Frankly, arguments have been made that we should indeed frown more upon what a human does to an animal than what a human does to a human, but I won't go down that road because it'll sure lead to a rapid thread closure - except to say only, without prejudice, that those arguments are not irrational, but quite intriguing.)

Vick has shown himself to be someone who does not want to take responsibility and someone who is obviously missing a few of the compassion genes. Stallworth has only shown himself to be foolish (gee, how rare a trait that is), but who has also shown himself readily willing to accept responsibility for his own calamitous foolishness. Stallworth has not shown himself to be trash (in spite of the glib, foolish, and arrogant remarks of some) - indeed, his character as far as we can know is still an open question. Vick on the contrary has revealed any number of things about his character and these are not flattering.
PatS4
Sorry Terry.
I guess I should have read this thread earlier.
Just couldn't get through your essay.

As a multiple drunk driving offender, sad.gif

I think 30 days for manslaughter is a JOKE!!

JMO

Go Pack!!
Leader
As is sady too often the case, I'm drawn to reply to the intriguing thoughts of my learned associate from across the pond.......For context I must divulge having driven under multiple influences on multiple occasions. This is not a boast or evidence of sterling character - just a fact that colors my perception of Stallworths account of things.

What I found most interesting about Stallworth's heartfelt confessions were not the emotions expressed but the facts.....that he was in fact driving drunk albeit (supposedly) at not too great speed - recognized the pending accident and: honked his horn, flashed his lights and hit the brakes (all in the course of a few seconds) yet still the accident occurred. Well either he wasnt all that drunk or can multitask with the best of them in any condition as I'm sure I couldnt pull off all these mental and physical gyrations - AND STILL HIT THE GUY.

In other words, I dont believe him and think his story was laid on a bit too thick. Now, given the jeopardy he faced, the potential loss of freedom as well as millions of dollars.....perhaps he should also have mentioned having stuck his head out the sunroof and yelling at the guy to get out of the way!

It's an unfortunate circumstance and I make light (perhaps wrongly) but as to this:

For one thing, you already live in the most draconian society on earth regarding the administration of justice. America has a population that is roughly around 5% of the world's population, yet holds in her prisons 25% of the entire world's prison population. Study after study after study have shown that less leniency and more severe jail terms has no effect on reducing criminal activity....

We all know these studies are nothing more than leftist propaganda intended to destabilize the institutions of our great nation and bring about anarchy. Thank goodness they've failed to sway our government from locking up the many miscreants that surround us!

As to comparasions between Stallworth and Vick - I find myself (oddly) more repulsed by Vick's actions. Stallworth's was an avoidable accident - unfortunate indeed and with greater ultimate consequence, but stupid and unintended on his part. Mr. Michael is a different beast and his heart too dark for my liking.

Terry
Speaking of miscreants, I trust you're posting from the interior of a cell yourself, Leader. smile.gif

Seriously, though, I confess I didn't know what Stallworth said about it all. I was going entirely on information put forward in this thread. You make a good point about his confession.

I was incredibly lucky when I was about 21 and it instantly brought about a change in me forever after. I was having a merry old time buzzing around in a girlfriend's Carmen Ghia, pretending it was a high octane sports car, and, having had some drinks, nearly ran head on into a couple of pedestrians. There was a clear street off of which one curved onto a broad one way street which allowed a very lengthy run before a stop light - I was speeding some and flattened the curve a bit by driving (on that first segment) across the opposing lane. No cars were in sight, but a couple had stepped out of a parked car and commenced their crossing of the street in the dark, standing right in the middle of the opposing lane. Suddenly I was aimed right at them. I swerved left and actually drove between them and the far curb and I've thanked God ever since that moment (for nearly 40 years) that they just froze like deer and didn't leap backwards toward the curb to get out of the way. That really shook me up, in a huge, huge way. Since that day, I can't say I never drove again with a few drinks in me, but if I did, I drove at about 10 mph. Now I simply don't drink when I'm out, but when I have done, I wasn't driving, at least ever since I hit 25.

So I guess I'm a little sympathetic to how easily a relatively sensible person can behave really stupid and end up screwing their life. I've been blessed, really (knock on wood) that my brain farts and other stupidities have not ended in disaster. And, IMHO, those who glibly would throw such people in dungeons and throw away the key are not only lacking in compassion, but have either forgotten or, worse, are just plain oblivious to all the times in their lives their own stupidities could have cost so very much to their own lives. This is not about making excuses for people or failing to recognize that certain types of problems absolutely must be addressed.

I'm in tune with the sentiment that 30 days is absurd, but I'd be inclined to sentence the guy to years of community service rather than to an expensive cell, out of which no benefit will come. But that's just me.
Leader
QUOTE (Terry @ Sep 14 2009, 07:35 PM) *
Speaking of miscreants, I trust you're posting from the interior of a cell yourself, Leader

Damn internet! Cant keep anything private anymore.
Actually....no....they cut me loose some years back LOL
mikebpackfan
QUOTE (Terry @ Sep 10 2009, 04:44 AM) *
Vick has shown himself to be someone who does not want to take responsibility and someone who is obviously missing a few of the compassion genes. Stallworth has only shown himself to be foolish (gee, how rare a trait that is), but who has also shown himself readily willing to accept responsibility for his own calamitous foolishness. Stallworth has not shown himself to be trash (in spite of the glib, foolish, and arrogant remarks of some) - indeed, his character as far as we can know is still an open question. Vick on the contrary has revealed any number of things about his character and these are not flattering.



I completely agree with this. But for some reason, the subheading "In fairness, it's not like he killed any dogs or anything" still makes me laugh.
Terry
I understand why it's funny. Alas, I'm a bit O/C about dogs, which diminishes my capacity for humour. In principle, it shouldn't. Anything in human affairs is fair game, I believe - comedy is just an extension of tragedy after all. I can usually laugh at dog jokes, even make them... so there's hope for me. :-)

You want something to make you laugh and cry, try this:
James Stewart and Beau

QUOTE (Leader @ Sep 14 2009, 05:18 PM) *
Damn internet! Cant keep anything private anymore.
Actually....no....they cut me loose some years back LOL

Yes, I know. That's when I left the country. I figured nowhere was safe, what with you, Stallworth, and Randy Moss on the loose, Moss with lady cops decorating his bonnet and all. Not to mention some maniac driving around in that ancient possessed Carmen Ghia that was no doubt the basis for "Christine".
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